This. Ends. NOW.

Discussion in 'Community Discussion' started by EnderMagic1, Aug 20, 2016.

?

We need to end this.

Yes. 21 vote(s) 56.8%
No. 16 vote(s) 43.2%
  1. Change. Sometimes that word can mean two things. Good or Bad. Its been going in the wrong direction for way too long. The empire is slowly crumbling, lets face the problem. It may not seem like a big deal, but this thread is to point out all these problems. Even the forums, it is slowly deteriorating and crumbling, like rotten bread. Not everyone is this way though, there are some good people that are trying to change the situation, but they haven’t made a big change yet. However, I will step up and state my opinion. I have been so fed up with the forums recently. Its made me really mad. People aren’t being nice anymore, especially with other players.
    Okay, lets go into the least-depressing topics first. I think people are too laid back on comments. Like some people talked about (Kephras :p), not enough alerts are being passed around. People are too nervous to stand out or make a like. When you get a like, it makes you feel good, so you can give more likes to other people. So, if we increase our likes, everyone can become semi-happier. Its like a circle of likes. ;) You are probably wondering, What the heck does this have to do with emc?! Well, more likes and encouragement = a more positive environment. Some people have been discussing a dislike button, or negative ratings. That is just wrong. If you are so annoyed with some people, leave them alone and don’t participate in their stuff/threads. This brings me to my next point, my hated topic of all time: bullying.
    I have experienced it before. I know what it feels like to be discriminated with no one standing up for you. Over my childhood, I have learned some lessons into bullies. Cyber-bullying is another thing as well. In-game and in the forums, this type of behavior is unacceptable. Some people are trying their best and I thank you for that. Personally, I have tried, but they won’t back down. Have you noticed a bunch of players are leaving? This whole situation is causing our funny, great players to leave. All those people you used to joke with during firefloor? *Poof* They might not blatantly state their reasons for departure, but I know this is the true reason. And for those people who back those bullies up with likes, shame on you. A tiny little internet community can’t develop personality, your personality is with you already. If you don’t complete stuff on task, fine. If you can’t spell right or use smiley faces, fine. If you don’t write stories well, fine. Real life shapes your personality, not this. Stop discriminating people on what they do/act. Like I said before, leave them ALONE. Those bullies feel like arguing? FINE. Your puny counter will be washed away by dozens of responses. Argue all you want. I 100% guarantee you the whole emc community will back me up and the staff.. So, shut up.

    This community is supposed to be a team, helping each other out. Instead, its becoming into clans vs clans vs rogue factions. We need to unify! I know there will be backlash, so fellow emc members, like this thread and stand up against those bullies. We need to finish this problem once and for all. I apologize if I said anything really rude to the mods, I was just really mad at this problem. I hope you have a good day. -Ender.
  2. EMC is becoming like the real world...
  3. And just like the real world, nothing will be done if you choose to wait for the authorities, for example, There's a mad man at your front door cursing and trying to break it down with all of his force, if you just call the police and wait, you'll probably lose a door and probably your life, if you call the police and think up what you could do in the meantime to better your odds, you'll probably come out on top. We got minds to think, we aren't primitive, we all have an input in this world, make the best of it while you still can, sitting and complaining won't do much of a difference, but to go and do something is the way to make something happen. Like dealing with a bully, nothing will happen until you do something about it, standing up to him with your mind to help you out in a fight by knowing what hits are coming and how to hit harder. Community, getting the people you know to help you out in your situation. Or exploitation of a system, trick the authority into putting attention into the matter you're stuck in. You were born with a mind to think and a mouth to speak. Every way can or will have flak to come back at you, but that's just what the world is. A consequence to an action.
  4. I, personally, have seen none of what you describe here (besides the dislike/disagree button suggestion).
  5. I agree.
    OriginalScuf likes this.
  6. I agree.
    JesusPower2 likes this.

  7. you mean stop holding people accountable for their actions? why? if someone is acting like a putz then why should they get away with it? its up to the community to keep those people in line and let them know their behavior is wrong. and then if they continue that behavior for mods to step in and say enough. you are pretty new here so you dont really understand that people are constantly leaving. the aforementioned change you are talking about is why people leave emc has evolved into a much more positive environment then it used to be it just has downpoints. usually these downpoints happen when the summer wraps up because kids know they arent going to be able to play so they start acting up. aside from ganging up on HKR which anyone who has been around knows she misbehaves alot. i havent seen any prevalent bullying. and when staff noticed the bullying they stepped in. as far as critiquing staff, why dont you apply? the only way to ferment real change is from within, you dont understand the rigors of being staff unless you have been one. its not easy, it seriously takes a toll on your playtime. so some staff take breaks, usually if they remain staff these breaks are recommended by krysyy or one of the mints. in order to keep a cool head and not ferment drama staff routinely have to step back and let others take over.
  8. I tend to agree with the OP. I have seen some of it happening myself.

    Unfortunately things aren't always as clean cut as you think they are and you have to be very careful with jumping to conclusions here.

    True story, but I'm obviously not sharing further details: someone started talking in town chat to a moderator about their missing stuff. Rumour had it a player scammed them. A friend of mine pointed them to GRIP (I'm sure we can be lenient, scamming is a form of griefing I think). Their problem at hand: they were broke. Some time later I see that same player trying to sell a dragon egg for 10k on another SMP. I didn't follow up on that because I didn't believe this to be real. So 30 or so minutes later another friend of mine tells me that "someone tried to sell a renamed egg for a dragon egg as joke". Turned out to be the same person.

    Now, this is not a story about right or wrong. This is a story about how things may look very obvious at first but when you look deeper into it you'll sometimes discover a completely different situation. And generally speaking staff has access to more information about players than us. Also keep in mind that all staff related things happen behind the scenes, in private.

    Still... hearing that a moderator was present when that egg thing happened did irk me a little bit. It seems no further action was taken there.

    As to bullying: agreed.

    But I also think players should try to rely more on other players and not only on the staff. Staff can do a lot, but (and you may quote me on this): I also believe that in several situations regular players can do a whole lot more.

    And there is another thing... Did players really bully or did the other player merely pick it up as such?

    Another true story (and once again no details): A player comes onto SMP2 and someone else comments about their name. They grinned ("lol") about it and basically told the player that they liked their name. The player in question got annoyed because they felt that the other was making fun of them. So they left. I can well understand why they felt that way, but I do not agree that the other player was out for mischief. Especially not when seeing the aftermath of all that.

    Sometimes you can pick up a comment in a completely different way than it was intended.

    So what happens if you think someone is verbally attacking you and you give a rude comment back? Instant fight in the making. And in the end both players will feel that they were right because "the other player started it" while in reality it was all a big misunderstanding.

    Staff can do a lot, but I don't think staff has the time & resources to try and fix every single case. Also because some incidents could have started months ago!

    Honestly... The first thing a player who feels that they're being bullied should do is talk to other players. And if your friends can't help you talk to other well known players. My inbox is always open for example.

    Also: /ignore can help a lot. If you don't like another player, then why continue talking and arguing with them? /ignore them and be done with it.
    Jelle68, Kytula, 607 and 2 others like this.
  9. I kinda agree with this. I have noticed many players that were my friends or foes leaving for good and some just for a couple months or so but there leaving EMC D: All the times I have been on EMC there is always a problem and/or drama going on. I play EMC because its fun, friendly and a way to escape real life. But recently EMC has been turning into real life problems and some bad people are ruining the fun.

    I have noticed some people starting a problem and being rude then after they do all that bad stuff and hurting others feelings they just say well idc right now irl im having a problem and all, there just dragging reality into a game which is not what we want!

    ( im not giving names here ) Sorry to the mods, that im saying this but one of my friend came up to me a long time ago and said oh im back i was banned for an hour cause some other person. They told me the story of what happened and I asked them if they told the staff what happened and he said no cause that staff member wouldn't let them and jut banned them for that time.
    Also I have been hearing from some random people coming by saying stuff like oh yea this staff member wasnt doing there job. They dont let you explain anything to them, they just ban you.
    I have heard from some people in the past saying that that staff member isnt doing there job not letting u explain just banning them and all these rumors where about the same staff member.

    Well idk if these rumors i have heard are true since idk if I can trust anyone anymore. There is so many problems and drama going on in EMC. People are saying EMC is falling apart, I dont agree with that but I do say that EMC is getting a lil side tracked from what we should really be like, that fun and friendly, family server that everyone loves!

    And some people yell at you and question you and even send u various PM's if you just simply change your name saying oh well your gonna get bullied if you change your name to Lil_Emo_Cat. Your not fit to have that name it doesn't even suit you! First of all those people dont know me irl how can they say this things if they dont know me.
    It is true my name might not look like it suits me but im using my outside self. I pretend to be that nice, sweet, and friendly girl but really irl im more of that independent, non-social, rude at sometimes girl.
    TheFenix, khixan and ShelLuser like this.
  10. **NOTE: I don't mean personal offense to any staff or players, this is my opinion and my offer at constructive criticism
    I know how you feel. The friendly feel is losing its touch and EMC is shifting away from the feel of us all being a family, to us all being citizens to a country. It use to be where if a player was being annoying, we as a community would just overlook it and let it be. We wouldn't feed the troll or belittle anyone, we would just go on with our day. Now there is so much more internal hostility between players, it really reflects what the real world looks like... Certain players are constantly being bashed because one day, one of us thought it would be fine to take our anger out on players. Other players saw this and join in, either to "fit in" with other bullies or their temptation of keeping their mouth shut if they aren't going to say something nice had caved. Whatever their reasons, they will never justify bullying

    I totally agree with you here. Now I'm not saying go around and like everyone posts just 'cuz' :p but what I am saying is if you're going to say "+1" on a suggestion, at least have the decency to give the OP a like instead of upping you post count. That's really one of my biggest pet peeves because it basically just tells me that you want to up your post count but you're too "special" (or maybe you don't even consider it) to like that players post. I mean if you're going to say "+1" or agree with someone, you might as well give them the like because that's a main reason likes were added. Before I get back on topic here, know I'm not talking about people who actually add feedback, I'm talking about the people who solely comment +1. You summed up the dislike button pretty well. Its gotten to the point where you need a dislike button to express your feelings, maybe this isn't the place for you. And im usually not one to tell people to leave a server but that mindset just poisons the community and breeds more and more hatred/negativity

    This happens too often and especially in regards to a certain player. Everytime this player makes a thread the same gang of smart-asses show up to belittle and pick on the player. Of course its the usual bullying situation: You got the people posting (the bullies), you got the people liking all the bully's posts (the bystanders), and the staff who give little to no actual punishments and try to take the friendly way out (the adult who think they helped but just made it worse). The answer to beating all this negativity and stopping all this bullying is simple. Punish the people responsible... I'm not talking about putting them on mod review or asking them to stop, I mean temp bans. On the latest thread the certain player made, it took around 10 responses from the bully that were obviously made with malicious intent before staff even gave a mod review. To be honest, I was surprised staff even did that because out of the 20 or so threads that player has made, been bullied on, and then got locked, it was the first time I actually saw any action taken. A lot of people may disagree, but I want stricter staff. Staff willing to cut down on people's bullcrap, violation of loopholes, or rudeness towards other players. As you said, its really only been a few select players that were tired of these bullies who have actually stood up and told the bullies to stop

    To summarize my thoughts, the bonds of the community will only weaken as the negativity grows. The staff team needs to cut down and have 0 tolerance for bullies. We as individuals need to be less self-center and think more of others. We need to turn the cheek to inciting drama and instead just go about with our day. Through all these things, we can make EMC a family community again

    Just my 2 cents yo! :)
    TheFenix, 607, khixan and 4 others like this.
  11. First of all the obvious: you always get once sided comments. Quite frankly I think a lot of players feel that staff isn't doing enough instead of too much. For example: seeing someone trying to sell a renamed egg as if it was a dragon egg is scamming in my opinion. Apparently a present staff member felt that there was no harm done and it got brushed off as a joke. Can't say I agree with that, but I also don't know what happened behind the scenes either.

    As to EMC falling apart... Also check the age of some players. A lot of leaving players have been on the Empire for a long time. And some day a game will become boring. Heck, I've only been here for 600 days and I also have had my moments where I thought... "meh, I'll go catch a movie instead" or where I simply got bored a bit :p

    But right now we also get plenty of new players. Stuff changes, a server will always be on the move like that.
  12. In reference to all these staff related incidents you're talking about, I don't know what it's all about and I haven't heard those rumours or any of those stories, but remember that Krysyy, the community manager, is always there if there is anything wrong when it comes to staff actions. If a player has a problem with a staff action, a staff member in general for some reason or another, or wants to know if the punishment was warranted then you can talk to Krysyy. If a staff member is not doing their job then tell Krysyy and she'll make sure everything is sorted.

    As for this thread, I can't say I've seen EMC going downhill as such. You say we should ban rude players? We do. But we also like to give players chances. EMC would not be fun if the slightest thing you said, or something you said in retaliation to being provoked by something got you into severe trouble all the time. Yes, sometimes there is bullying, but it gets dealt with. One key thing to always remember is that staff are not absolutely everywhere 100% of the time, you need to report, or PM staff to get something done.

    I may be a relatively new green bean, but this does target me as well so I'll make my comment. Where are we? We're right here, ready to help. But I can't help you if I don't know you need help. Send a PM, make a report, EVERY single one gets claimed and dealt with accordingly. You say you see occasional warnings, but you don't see everything that goes on in the background. Everything gets dealt with, and if you don't think it's dealt with, report it again. Make sure it gets sorted. If it isn't sorted and we don't know, we can't do anything. As I say, every report is dealt with, so the key really is to report if there is a problem. Bullies will get banned if they are continuously rude, and there are many people you can talk to for help.

    With this Marlix incident, I'm not 100% sure on what it was, but if it was reported then it will be sorted, and if it isn't sorted properly then refer to my comment with Emo Cat - get Krysyy involved. It will get verified, or the action will get changed, depending on what the outcome should be, after looking at all of the evidence. As far as Marlix loot goes for when two people kill a Marlix, only one person will get a Marlix piece (i.e. a Marlix Helmet) if it drops. Marlix, nor staff, will give you a second one just because you killed that mob with someone else. Share it out among yourselves. A staff member cannot magic up more pieces because only one person of two got some loot. As I said, I don't know the exact situation so I can't answer this completely, but if there truly was a scamming then warnings and the correct outcome will happen as long as the incident was reported.

    If staff only want staff for the title then they won't be staff for much longer. If you believe a staff member is not doing their job, PM Krysyy. She'll take it up with the staff member if there's something they can do better, or worse if all they want is the title and nothing else.

    Everyone has a life outside of EMC, staff don't live here, we have other things to do just like everyone else. I wasn't on EMC for the past week because I've been on holiday. People get ill, people go away, people need a break, people play another game for a while. It all happens to people, and you know what? Staff are people too. It's no different. If a staff member is truly bothering you with being away for a really long period and you think they aren't doing their job properly, tell Krysyy. You get the pattern here - if a staff member isn't doing something right or isn't doing something at all, you should report it to the community manager.

    If anyone wants to talk to me about particular issues then feel free to PM me, or if you want to add to my post, quote me here. Just remember - report it, it will get dealt with, and if you genuinely aren't happy with an action and have reason to believe staff aren't doing their job properly, tell Krysyy about it and it will get dealt with.
    Kytula, Rezxz, 607 and 12 others like this.
  13. I can't say I've seen anything that is true 'bullying' either...
    Sure, I have seen feelings hurt by not-so-rude things taken the wrong way and that kind of thing makes my insides melt. People then panic and the thread is locked. The initial party then feels slammed, and does some controversial thing/post/whatever, repeating the cycle.

    Commenting on threads in general is great, and I think everyone needs to learn how to take constructive criticism. Especially if that constructive criticism is aimed at the person's acceptance of constructive criticism. I'm included in all this :p
    slash14459, FDNY21 and jkjkjk182 like this.
  14. (Havent read all above comments)

    I believe a large contributing factor to the amount of drama on here is the player base. Minecraft attracts a wide audience, including little kids and people who don't have a lot of experience talking online ( like myself). I have a hard enough personality to understand in real life, take away tone of voice and facial expressions in chat and nobody gets what I'm saying half the time. When it comes to text, it can be hard to find what the author meant by it. This can lead to misunderstandings and people getting upset. Also, the 9 year old (and just immature people in general) audience is still learning how to act, and so they spread drama because it's "fun". Heck, I know someone who got banned for drama and they still don't get what they did wrong. He appealed, but it was difficult for him because he basically had to admit something he didn't think he did. A lot of things said on chat can be taken as mean or an attack when it really isn't meant to be like that. Be patient with people.
  15. This thread is generating some long post responses. That at least means players are giving it thought and putting effort into expressing their views. Great job EnderMagic1!

    I'll add my thoughts here in light of how I see some interpreting his message...

    Over the last two years I've seen a rise in clique culture here. That's not necessarily bad, though yes it reflects "real life". When it goes bad is when being part of the clique skews a person's judgement (aka bias). When it goes bad is when groups of players respond to a single player with overtly negative tones.

    Regarding offensive and rude posts, posts that are targeted, posts that are troll bait...I believe staff is far too lenient. Yes, I don't see the whole story, I only see the after effects and the lingering negativity. In my view we're doing a poor job of making this a safe environment. Posts that add nothing to a discussion and only serve to ridicule another should be removed (IMO).

    I've created a suggestion post which I hope you'll all consider.
    https://empireminecraft.com/threads/suggestion-forum-section-for-moderated-threads.67278/
    607, kaptrix, ShelLuser and 1 other person like this.
  16. I do have a few things to say in regards to this thread...

    a) I have seen much of this stuff on the forums, not so much in game, but it is definitely an issue on the forums. Even I, personally, have been discouraged from posting on certain threads due to my comment just being shot down.

    b) Some people are turning EMC into some extreme economy ultra-grind hardcore mega-mall rupee machine of terror, with the one and only aspect of this to make as many rupees as possible. This isn't an upfront issue, as EMC encourages freedom to do whatever. It might just be from my point of view with me not having any interest in doing this, but certain people can sound like elitists, in a way due to their wording and the activities they partake in. It can seem at times like the forums and in-game is widely separated into the economy-gurus versus the casual players such as myself, who just play Minecraft to build little houses and mine a few diamonds and such. I think that this can be a source of some problems with rudeness, depending on the player in question, of course.

    c) Staff presence can be limited on the forums from what I have seen due to the number of threads, but I do feel like they could be on any thread at a moment's notice, with a simple PM in game or on the forums. I personally don't see it as a total state of abandonment, or an iron fist rule, but somewhere comfortably in the middle.
    lukafolz, ItsMeMatheus and khixan like this.
  17. Specifically for forum stuff, the best way to draw our attention to stuff is using the report button below each post. It puts a notification at the top of all staff member's screens that look a bit like this, so will help get the quickest response possible.

    Best Minecraft Servers
  18. Oh yeah, forgot about the report button. That too
  19. i agree with some of this post but don't agree with other parts first off i want to start with the bullying issue i understand there's a bullying issue and i agree that those people that do this should be banned but they should have at least a chance at forgiveness. Also i would like to address the staff i agree that some of the staff members are not as active as we would like and i agree that they should step down if they're going to be inactive, but you cant just diss them like that and say they are not doing enough because without the staff we wouldn't have the server and nobody would get banned at all.
    JesusPower2 and ShelLuser like this.