[FEEDBACK] Dev Mistakes - Eggs (CLOSED)

https://empireminecraft.com/wiki/enraged-guardian-egg/ same thing... yet now leprechauns are causing a controversy?

If I recall correctly only one person discovered this, and it was immediately reported,

I think the controversy here is that this time, several people found it and didnt report it, which is not the first time in recent EMC history that people chose to not report a bug, I can see why that would be frustrating to the devs

it was reported by me... im probably the first person to discover it

I also found a zombie leprechaun in a cave next to where I was already curing some trading villagers and therefore discovered the bug. Then I saw Envine talking about it and that he'd reported it. With confirmation that Chicken knew about it and had said he planned to disable leprechauns shortly I didn't figure there wasn't a need to also report it. This could be the case for some others, I don't know, not trying to make excuses.

I'm not sure there's any great solution now, it's all compromise. Obviously since I have one it would be in my best interest to say "do nothing" but that's clearly not the best for the community as a whole, just the few people that found the bug. I feel like self destruction is nearly as bad of an option through? At this point I'm mostly just thinking as far as... Managing controversy. Being that these exist, have been distributed, and sold (for far too much), the community fallout of nuking them seems far worse than something like making them fully available.

The situation is not fair, but deleting them also does not seem fair now that they've been circulated. At least not for people who have bought, sold, or traded them. And the admin of having to walk back those transactions (and the interpersonal politics involved) would be a nightmare that could not possibly be worth it. Making them available to everyone seems like the best option at this point.
(I already clicked "other" on the poll and can't change it :/)

I second this! I feel that the best way to uphold the rules in the future and minimize anger with this incident is to warn players against exploiting items at risk of having them destroyed in the future, but make the leprechaun eggs in particular available to everyone for fairness. I also agree with 99marvel's assertion that the community fallout of destroying an item that's already widespread would be immense compared to just making it available legitimately.

I just saw this post this morning, and I've been thinking about it for the past couple hours. I've considered the options in the poll you created, and a few that I've thought of on my own, and it really only feels right in this circumstance to self-destruct the eggs.

People knew what they were doing was wrong and mischievous, yet they did it anyway without any care for consequences of their actions. They intentionally destroyed the intentional safeguard against eggification, which to me constitutes an exploit. In my opinion, people who did it just to have a collectable special item shouldn't be punished, as it's nice to know that you yourself have something that not a lot of others have, even if you know you shouldn't have it; just keep it to yourself and don't share it. Those people should get to keep them.
I get it... In the past, I've had one of a kind items that shouldn't have existed (stares at chickeneer) and I was really happy to have it, but I told people and showed off and they were taken from me.

On the other hand, other people exploited this functionality and used that exploit to turn a profit. In this case, those are the players that should be punished and have disciplinary action taken against them and their "prize". The eggs should be removed from these players.

Knowing that we can't just take the eggs from some people, and not the ones just having fun, I vote to take them from everyone. In the end, it was an exploit and rules were broken. In the case of the auctions of this item, the winnings should be debited from the seller's account. Nobody should win from these illicit transactions. Yes, while this has been done in the past without any action against it; now is the time to do something or nothing will ever change.

Going forward, perhaps we (EMC) could have a red team in order to make the promos exploit proof before release. That could be a secondary responsibility for the Think Tank, or its own separate team. I know first hand how saddening it feels to have your hard work ripped apart and used for nefarious purposes.

I would love to discuss further on the above viewpoints, only if that discussion won't create hostility in this thread. Thanks for listening.

That's a clever and principled idea! Perhaps chickeneer and/or MoreMoople should debit those that have illicitly auctioned the spawn eggs the amount that they profited but not make the items self-destruct! I didn't think of that; your idea seems even more principled than my suggestion to simply make the items legitimately available (which I still favor), warn people against such exploits with penalty of the item being destroyed in the future (which I also still favor) and make it as though none of this happened with the leprechaun eggs specifically.

its simple, destroy the eggs.. break the rules, deal with the consequences

Have a little firework rocket go off when the eggs are coded to self destruct. "Expired leprechauns"

Okay, but you must see that it is not that simple. Sure, if only the people that egged them to start with still had them, it could be that simple. But they've been in circulation now. It's not just a matter of people going "my exploited eggs are gone *cries* ((((". The same people that would theoretically do that are the people that are going to be even more noncompliant to refunding transactions. And that is a moderation nightmare.

Is it fair to let people who abused the exploited keep tons of rupees or traded promos, when effectively they traded those for nothing? Is it fair to the people who bought the eggs to just have nothing? The "consequences" are just way more complex and unbalanced than it would seem at first glance.

Don't think like that. You create awesome things that the players enjoy. Be proud of that!

My vote -- just leave it. Spend your time on more important things.

and as we speak.. those people who used this exploit are still trying to sell these items before any verdict is made.. i think refunds should be made, the items should be destroyed and anyone who does not comply should be dealt with by moderators and staff.. people should not have benefited from an exploit to begin with, and now that its being debated to remove the items, why are these people continuing to try and sell them.. if someone exploited, and is now trying to take advantage and sell off the items before they are removed, then they should be forced to refund or ban in my opinion.. especially if you are trying to sell AFTER this thread has already been made and considered

if i'm going to be fully honest, those who made any deals before this thread have an argument to be made, they just saw an opportunity and then sold.. i still think its wrong and those people should be giving refunds if the items do get destroyed.. but i have 0 sympathy for anyone who has sold or is attempting to sell the item after this thread was made.. now those people are just trying to quickly sell the item to people who don't know about the potential of the item getting destroyed and that type of taking advantage should not be okay.. anyone who sells one now should be given a harsher punishment than just giving a refund and having the item destroyed

but that is just my opinion, to be honest whatever chicken decides will probably work out just fine and this bit of controversy will glaze over quickly following that.. i look forward to seeing what action is chosen and whether or not the poll will be followed by most chosen or by what chicken thinks is the most fair outcome

Why are people mad about this but not Netherhound eggs or Enraged Zombie/Guardian eggs? People are acting like this is a duplication glitch but weird unintended variants and items have always been seen as collectibles in the EMC promo market. And for those upset about people keeping it secret; if I knew about a game mechanic that made my farms more efficient and didn’t share it to gain a competitive edge, would you be so upset? It’s up to you to try things out for yourselves, don’t be mad at the people who did.

obviously the only answer is to create a promo given to those who are first to report a bug

I think mad hasn't been demonstrated in this thread. I think disappointed is a way I would describe it. Every time Chickeneer releases anything there is always the, if you see any bugs please report them, statement included with the release notice. It's very simple, egging the leprechaun was not an intended feature. It should have been reported. From what I've read in this thread, it was reported, but then an action was started a day or so after reporting the bug. That's not right.

This would be a very nice incentive for reporting bugs but it would require even more effort of the staff than a simple thank you that we receive now.

The main reason why it's an issue now, is because there was an intentional mechanic preventing eggification from the beginning.

With netherhounds, there were no protections in the beginning and people could just egg them.

With the enraged guardians/zombies, there wasn't protection there to start because you couldn't eggify hostile mobs. Curing the zombie villagers wasn't considered so they didn't see any way for people to eggify it.

This time, there was code specifically designed to stop you from eggifying the villager. People intentionally bypassed this code by converting it to a zombie and curing it. That's why it's an issue.

Netherhounds are hostile mobs, I don’t think they intended for them to be eggifiable - if they did, they still would be.

And they allowed people to keep them.

i understand that everyone is looking back at the enraged mobs and the netherhounds as like their biggest counter arguments as to why we should just ignore these and let the people keep their leprechauns but tbh i don't think that is a very strong or convincing argument.

first off, that was a different time in EMC, and whether or not we all agree or disagree with the decisions made back then, it was a decision made in the past that the staff at the time felt made the most sense, it does not mean that in current day, that decision was correct and should be continued to be followed. we need to figure out what is best for current EMC and not just live by the past decisions made by a different group of people in a different time on the server.

at the end of the day chicken will make the decision that he seems is best for the server, and hopefully this discussion board has helped him wake way into a conclusion on all that. i do just want to emphasis that until any decisions are made about the leprechauns and their future, people should refrain from attempting to sell them and 'make a quick buck' before they are potentially removed or more are created, or they remain the same. there is no need to attempt to take advantage of players who are unaware that the items may or may not be getting removed

Sorry, i,ve never once seen this but i'm also someone who only reads the title of most things.