Standing with Standing Rock

I didn't even know about this until now. o_o That's insanity! What the heck are they thinking???

The problem with these things is that you always get to hear 1 sided stories, and this is in my opinion no different. Of course the protesters will say that they're within their right and not using violence whereas obviously the police will say different. It's a given.

Another problem I have is the careful use of wording. "incidents" which could happen with this pipeline and have happened with others (the '500+ average incidents per year' quote) . But what these incidents consist of is left open to the imagination of the viewer while they obviously show us spills and such. That's a little bit misleading.

Now, Wikipedia isn't the best and most reliable of resources, but they do keep a list of pipeline accidents in the US. And you'll notice that some of those incidents can't and shouldn't be used within this context. From what I can tell this pipeline is a buried one, so incidents which involve a pipeline rupturing and then spilling its contents out in the open are not fully usable here.

Another example are incidents of ruptured pipes because of construction work. Considering the massive protests which are going on now I'd say its safe to assume that no further construction would be done. So you can rule those potential causes for incidents out as well. And then you see that it gets harder to reach 500 potential incidents per year.

That doesn't mean I'm saying that there is no risk at all. But it does surprise me how many people seem to forget (or ignore!) that oil in its basic form is still a natural component. When a spill occurs it is bad for the environment (your classic smeared birds and inhabitable beaches). But it's a fantasy that it remains that way forever to come. It takes time, but eventually the oil does disperse because it gets broken down by several bacteria and micro organisms which live in the waters. Sure: thats not something which happens over a weeks time and it also doesn't mean that there's no problem or damage being done at all.

But it's still not as hopeless as some people want you to believe either.

I also can't help wonder if there's a little more going on than merely the pipeline alone.

Because lets be honest here: in the end this is yet another violation of the legally owned grounds by the Sioux and other tribes. And as we all know the US has a rather black and dark history when it comes to acknowledging and respecting the rights of those tribes. So it's only natural (and fully understandable!) that they get upset over this and perceive it as yet another violation of their historical rights. In a way I'm sure some perceive this as history repeating itself all over.

But that's still not quite the same as having concerns over the possible impact on the environment. And we do realize that not every pipeline has to be dug out from above ground these days, right?

EDIT

It would appear (but you can never be 100% sure) that the land through which the pipeline should go was voluntarily sold by the land owners. Where some of the land owners were also a member of the involved tribes.

For me this changes a lot. Because it's also not uncommon for a government (or a company operating on behalf of said government) to simply disown people (I believe this is the right term) because of the greater good. Yet that doesn't seem to apply here.

So in the end I'm not voting

I think there's much more to this story than is being told here.

I live in Iowa and have petitioned our state government to not allow eminent domain to be abused in this manner. Farmland stolen away from families that have owned it for generations to give to private corporations only to enrich that corporation. None of what is happening will in anyway benefit the general population. It is a true crime of epic proportions. And when the accident happens, and it ultimately will, who will have to deal with the aftermath? The citizen will, not the big corporation or the billionaires that have benefited from this. This is just an example of how the country as a whole is going. The republicans let the wealthy and big corporations do whatever they want. It doesn't matter how many people they hurt. And then the wealthy donate more money to them and their campaigns. It makes me want to cry to watch all this happening to our wonderful country. But there is nothing that can be done I am afraid. These republican state governments and politicians have told these corporations they will get the land. The politicians have probably already been counting their money. And now the republicans have been validated in the election.

Yeah, that's a part which would also upset me. I called it "disowning" up there, which seems to be the wrong term. But it's plain out wrong when the government "simply" confiscates peoples private properties for the sole benefit of making some extra cash over it. Because that's where all reports are very clear about: we're talking some serious monetary interests here, and money can do strange things to people.

An excellent point indeed. Something which I didn't even think of because on this side of the globe we hardly have to deal with such events which makes it easy to forget about those.

It is an absolute fact that the government doesn't always have the best interests in mind for its citizens. Even though we're the ones who pay their salary through all those taxes.

I also agree about the police behavior. At most they should be there to protect the citizens. After all: there is a fundamental freedom of speech which applies here, people have a right to protest. And I agree that something seems fishy here because of all the different reports which are clear on one thing: the violence.

Good going!

Well, that heavily depends. Even though the government tries very hard to limit the power of the people, in the end its still a force to reckon with. And something strange things happen.

You see the same (to a certain extend) happening in Europe. The corporations are the ones who really benefit from all the European rules and regulations while the citizens more than often see themselves pay for all of it. It was for a very obvious reason why taxes in our country went up from 19% to 21% for example (long offtopic story).

So yeah, it can never hurt to raise more awareness.

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CNN is reporting that the pipeline will be rerouted #NODAPL

The pipeline leaked 176k gallons of crude oil 150 miles north of the protest grounds. This is exactly what these people were protesting, and should prove a point.

My father works in green energy, specifically designing and planning large wind farms (500+ turbines). In the 8 years he has been working with the company, I've been on dozens of projects and many meetings, getting the first hand experience of his work. He regularly works with landowners that have/had oil and natural gas deals with companies (fracking, drilling, pipelines, you name it), and there is a near universal consensus. Water has been made undrinkable, land has been ruined structurally and agriculturally, and land value plummets; this is the result ALL fossil fuel has had on our environment. Whether or not a pipeline is underground is irrelevant, because it still will most likely penetrate drinking water (most rural areas still rely on well systems). If a pipeline bursts due to construction work, this is irrelevant too, because these pipelines will constantly be under some sort of maintenance or have construction surrounding them in their communities at all times. This doesn't including the effect is has once its actually used.

I worry most about the environmental impact, but the human rights violation of taking this reservation is beyond horrible. I've personally studied Native American history, and the way our Government has treated this people group has gone on too long.

Yes, there are many pipelines that operate safely, but with so many complex parts and such a high chance for catastrophic failure (ship oil spills, oil rig spills, pipeline bursts, of which there are many). No truly renewable energy has risks this high. This isn't a fight over one pipeline, this is a war against a cruel industry destroying lives and our planet. Don't even get me started on climate change.

I stand with standing rock, but even if you don't believe there will be a negative environmental impact, if you believe in the rights of the individual you should stand with Standing Rock.

You know......My biological mother is full Indian she has lived on a reservation. Sad thing is that this isn't the first time this has occurred. But I think it is ABSOLUTELY DISGUSTING that the only way we hear ANYTHING about this is through Facebook. Why isn't the media covering this?! Oh I don't know because Obama himself stated, that he could stop this with a stroke of a pen but is refusing too! The worst thing I heard, was that there were about 10-15 young Indian men and young men who rode their horses not armed up to cops, because the cops had their vehicles parked on ancient burial grounds. The indians pleaded please please don't sit there our ancestors are buried there please. They shot and killed the horses and shot and killed I believe 3-5 of the Indians. WHY?! They were not a threat! I am ex-military I took an OATH! That oath protects Americans! And guess what Indians are just as much American as anyone else! I stand with Standing Rock!

Ah, well my mistake. Either way it is absolutely disgusting! These people have been here LONGER than us! Like the video said since, the Nina, Pinta, and Santa Maria. My grandpa is full blood and lives right up the road. He had no clue as to what was happening so, I informed him and I have NEVER seen my poppa cry. He literally hung his head and wept for the Sioux Nation. He knows what it is like to deal with an government entity. When his Father died he didn't even have a birth certificate. I wish there was more I could do....

I think it's pretty sad that *some people* "don't care about this." If you're an American it's a really big deal, I mean we have a company that is shamelessly putting the water of the original inhabitants of AMERICA at risk of being poisoned, not to mention our current President Elect is a large stakeholder in the project. Says a lot about how much the government/big corps care about us. In the end we have the power to do something; to raise awareness, to speak out. And if we don't do it then the sin is on our heads.

And if you're not American you should still care. This is a great example of how the people in charge *all over the world* use their words so beautifully but in the end when it's time for them to act they do nothing. There's nothing to say you won't be put into a similar situation, so use this to open your eyes. And just look at Aleppo, mass genocide, war crimes going on there, just because it's not in your country doesn't mean you shouldn't care. We're all humans in the end dammit.

Aikar I just want to say thank you for passionately pushing this issue. This is an issue that prompts plenty of backlash even though the rights and wrongs are pretty clear, but you're still supporting and raising awareness. You got my respect.

Nice little plug there in the bottom right