Well that only took 20mins to read... Why did this even happen getting banned is one thing but having an argument about it with people who have what seems to be legit evidence is a little much.
The staff didn't bring up the fact that they had legit evidence until they were 10 or so pages into their debate.
Eh that's true but by then it should have stopped. Plus I don't think the staff where impressed either way.
What all of you (both sides) need to realize, and a very nice lady had to remind me of this fact, is that behind these words are real people typing. People with emotions, feelings, bias (yes, I said it) but most of all: none of us are perfect. My outrage earlier might not have been the smartest thing. I still stand by it though. Just because they are green doesn't mean they are machines which you can approach, push a few buttons and they'll spout the perfect answer for you. Those guys and girls got feelings also. From my pov I wouldn't rule out the option that some evidence is being withheld from the public for the banned players own welfare. There, I said it. THIS DOES NOT MEAN that Penguin did it. Nor do I imply as much. Thing is: as staff you cannot say "ok, we share evidence now because you look cool" and then later on go: "lets not share, your skin looks funny". I'm a sysadmin. It's my job. I do remote phone support for a company not to be disclosed, I have level 3 clearance, meaning so much that during my time of support I can escalate an issue and bring it directly before 1st line support (the dudes making the rules). The times I've heard, during my first sints, "I didn't sent that e-mail, someone else did". And then logs got pulled, IP addresses shown (only to a select crowd) and ..."maybe i was a bit too hasty". "you can see my IP address?". If they (my bosses) had released that info these guys would be the laughing stock of the department. EMC is no different. IMVHO the two players had a lot of opportunity here. But some things just can't get out in the open. For the record: I tried. Might even have ticked of Krysyy in the process. It was worth it IMO. (and see how wrong that sounds?).
We're having an argument because they refuse to present the evidence to anyone outside of their closed circle of people that most of the opposing party doesn't trust anyways (they could even censor the video but nope stubbornness is the motto). Reluctance to comply with either party fuels the fire.
May I add, almighty green gods of EMC (or at least what you think you are), nothing would be wrong with PRIVATELY sharing the evidence with your super secret CIA commands blurred out.
You all need some tea, some biscuits, a couch, some music, and a chill pill. Also some chloroform so you can sleep this the hell off. First of all, publicly confessing to using hacks as a 'funny prank' is downright ridiculous. If it was really banter among a few friends, surely you would have just typed that document up and sent it to them on some messaging platform with "do you think I should send this?", lead them on a for a while, and then pull the plug? At a certain point 'it's just a prank' is not a viable excuse. Sharing it with an entire community like this is practically begging for the ban. I'm not even going to comment on what the staff are doing. There's been slightly different stories from each one of them that have been here. That should probably be cleared up. Also this whole 'public ban appeal' thing serves no purpose other than to kick up drama. Sure, update the community on where it stands. We care about as much about the people here as we do in a real community and its a bad thing to see one of us drop off. But when you get denied the ban appeal even though you 'faked' the whole 'prank', starting public arguments with the staff is not the way to express your angst over it - the vast majority of the community will side with the staff. They were chosen as authority figures for a reason - they're trustworthy and have connections to other players here. Besides, the staff have more ammunition than you and they will keep chugging along with the counter-arguments and you'll burn up before they do. It's best to just accept that, move on, and try again when your appeal timer ticks down to 0. If you feel like there's something wrong with the system, go start a little group with some other people who feel the same way and do this stuff peacefully and in a professional manner. Don't go stirring stuff up and lashing out in public areas - it devalues your arguments, tarnishes your name, and if you really want to come back you make your chances even slimmer. Trust me. As a person who was upset at the staff lineup a few years ago and threw a tantrum when I didn't get my way, I speak from experience. Arguing doesn't work, especially out in the open. I'm lucky to even still be here after that, never mind as a Contribution Team member, which I think requires the staff to trust me on some level. I don't regret what I did, because I turned out to be a better person for it and from the sounds of it all parties involved did too, and I (quite selfishly) am quite happy with how content I am with my life right now, and I wouldn't be if I didn't do any of that. I'm just sad it took me doing that to be where I'm at now. Just my five pence on the topic ._. and wow this is a step up from the baby SoulPunisher I was at this time 2 years ago lol
But they think it's so secret, even if it's not, so let them have their way with that. I don't need to see the status reports of the command block clunkfest that is the UHC server. What is much more important is the footage of him peeing xraying.
I mean, I'm sure a couple of these arguments/statements are sound....but I didn't even take the time to read all 12 pages of chatter. I just read the first post and I was just like "yeah, common sense." It really does just boil down to common sense. Just play the game. Don't use hacks. Simple. (If something like this has already been mentioned, I don't care, I'm just stating my opinion)
It is a simple concept in theory, you are correct on that. The phrase "in theory" is where the problem lies. Where do you draw the lines on -alleged- pranking rules, or false accusations?
Haro - it's fine. Penguin's not getting unbanned. Innocent or guilty, it's not gonna happen. Don't waste your time.
I'll accept that, but it'd be nice to actually see some evidence or have somebody like you or penguin see it and confirm it instead of having to trust the people that I don't trust to confirm it. EMC's management looking like the U.S. government atm.
I'm as disappointed as you in how the Staff handled this, but whatever. It's absolutism, we have no power.
For those who think that a punishment based off of a confession and no investigation is not a real practice, you are very wrong. It is an extremely common practice. Fighting it usually involves trying to argue that the statement made was made under differing context than it was interpreted. I read the document where this confession was made, and there were no tells/signs/giveaways that indicated that this was done in humor. Even if the staff wanted to believe that this was done in humor, they wouldn't be able to based off of what they saw. If anything, this is a good wake-up call to everyone that trying to convince people that you broke the rules is a poor idea. In this case, there are no real world consequences. Other times, that is not the case. I am a student worker at the university I attend, and I deal with policy breaking conduct regularly. I essentially have a near direct line to the conduct board that decides your fate if you are thrown into their court. A confession is all that is needed to get yourself there, and it trumps nearly all other kinds of evidence. After you confess something, whether you were lying or not, the burden of proof lands on YOU. A disciplinary board with a confession does not need evidence to punish you, because the evidence is the confession itself. Recanting a confession is not allowed provided that the confession was not coerced (as Krysyy stated earlier, it is clear that this confession was voluntary), nor is it a tactic that can be used to attempt to prove your innocence. Also, there is a very big difference between the confession that PenguinDJ wrote and saying "lol i best pvper because of my hacks" in response to something like "jkjkjk182 tell me your secrets to being a pvp master." Again, it is all about context and setting. The staff here have done their investigation, they collected a confession. Whether this confession is true or not, no one knows that other than PenguinDJ.
If you have no trust in any of the staff, then why do you continue to play? The entire staff team is not going to lie. If you honestly believe they would, then you and I need to have a long talk in a pm.
i think having more than one account is classed as cheating and I think its self explanatory , TWO accounts one gives all the good stuff to the other one hence an advantage over other players
