Rebalancing the Empire Economy [slow induce]

Discussion in 'Community Discussion' started by Aikar, Jan 22, 2014.

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Thoughts on stimulating the economy (Note: Decision made, see post)

Leave it alone (please provide evidence/reasoning) 63 vote(s) 25.2%
Gradual increase until 10x lift 37 vote(s) 14.8%
Gradual increase until 25x lift 22 vote(s) 8.8%
Gradual increase until things are healthy and stable 105 vote(s) 42.0%
Don't care either way. 23 vote(s) 9.2%
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  1. I support raising the prices 10x because it is frustrating trying to have competing prices when it's between 1 and 2 rupees. I'm also torn because wouldn't it also lower the value of the money I already accumulated over 800 days? At the same time though, I could profit tons and make twice as much faster. I guess the Pros outweigh the cons.:)
  2. Equinox_Boss likes this.
  3. Wow... Here comes Lance with his detailed thoughts on all topics required large debate. Though I do agree with your point and others. I personally think that you should leave the Economy system should be left. Everyone in majority is happy with it. Changing it would cause confusion with certain people and there will be a large uproar of upset.
  4. Why do you think it would punish? Your new daily rupee intake would also start to increase.
    Again I also said it would not be instant, so the value of the current rupees would not be instantly cut to 10%.
    Now, if you sat their doing absolutely nothing for months, and then the economy does inflate upwards, then yes you would of lost value.

    But that would be an extreme case. This would be a slow process, so anyone sitting on current rupees would be able to grow that rupees value in the same speed if not more than the growth of the economy in general.

    I'm essentially just saying "Were going to give you more money" with the intent of a 10x lift in values.

    Unless you sit on a rock, current rupee stores would also receive a 10x lift. But then that would be the players fault for just letting it sit there unused.

    This form of inflation could still happen even without intent from our side as EMC grows.

    Again, not instant, so unless your looking for something like a 3 year return on investment on an EMC economy, not a very wise thing to do.

    Say you need 10 stacks of Iron Blocks for a build... 11.5k is a lot of money to a new player. And that's just on the Iron blocks! New players can not afford that.

    Now, if new players get 1k a day, they would be able to afford that iron within 10 days roughly.

    Today, it would take 100 days of income to be able to afford that. This isn't even considering the need for other resources such as food, weapons, armor, wood.

    Money is super tight as a new player. So of course they are not going to spend their entire balance on a single item such as iron.

    Again please do not look at it as an immediate 90% reduction in value.

    As explained above, people who have more cash on hand are at a better position to make even more money.

    For a real life comparison, if someone said here is a stock you know is going to grow by 10x over the course of a year, the people who have more money are going to be rewarded much more than those with less.
    Equinox_Boss likes this.
  5. You said: assuming everyone's money magically multiplied by 25. But that isn't the case, right? So then you would not be able to easily sell those diamonds because the people don't have the funds to do so.
    highlancer54 and Equinox_Boss like this.


  6. Agreed :) . It's kind of what the Germans did after WWI - they printed loads of money just practically making the money worthless.

    Isn't this kind of what this is? By making everything go up by x10, means that its just going to stay the same now. So example time:

    Person A (A) has: 10,000r
    Shop B (B) sells iron for: 2r per ingot

    -- X10 --

    Person A (A) has: 100,000r
    Shop B (B) sells iron for: 20r per ingot

    -- BEFORE --

    A can buy 5 thousand ingots from B.

    -- AFTER --

    A can buy 5 thousand ingots from B.

    -- OVERALL --

    There is no change. The rupee value goes up, prices go up, and the people can buy the same amount of an item even by having more money. There is honestly no way to forcibly change this economy. The only way would be to replace the whole thing, but that would require a conversion of rupees -> new currency...
  7. But the price of iron would have gone up, meaning they can only buy X amount of blocks per day anyway.
    highlancer54 likes this.
  8. Well, tbh, if this would happen, I'd spend all my rupees on buying stuff, saving it for a while, and then reselling it for 10x the r I spend on it originally.
    Equinox_Boss likes this.
  9. I agree with raising prices and rupee income -- although I do not know which would be better, a x10 lift, a x25 lift, or a gradual increase, so I just picked x10 on the poll. I wanted to explain: your explanation was clear, and you say you've done thorough research on the ins and outs of economic things, and, like you said, you manage a business -- not to mention that you're a server admin so you know better than anyone how players react to changes -- I think you'd know best. Whatever option works!
    BevK56 and Equinox_Boss like this.
  10. Also what about the shops that don't update their prices? A mega mall owner takes ages placing the signs at the right price, but to suddenly have a x10 increase, means they would need to be on ASAP to close it and get the signs updated, and that means checking against other stores.

    For new players to get more money, they have to be competitive on price with a shop, I know its hard but we've all done it. There are shops out there which will buy large amounts of items, I do, and I pay well (imo) too! But they never seem to understand that if they just get me items, I will pay them a lot, they can move onto their own shop and continue that way. I am a stepping stone for them such as many other shops across EMC
    Equinox_Boss likes this.
  11. What do you think would be confusing? I'm not talking about changing it over the course of a day, but just set things in motion for it to change naturally and slowly.

    If we raised all bonuses 20x, everything would be the same in a week.... prices would still be roughly the same.

    But, slowly, iron would hit 3r, then 4r, then 5, 6, 7, etc over the course of weeks/months. Players will see this as just the exact same as the price dropping.

    Diamond prices grow and fall. this is all natural.

    I'm not talking about FORCING prices to change, but simply giving it the means to change naturally.

    If players do not want the prices to go up even with an influx of rupees, then prices will still stay the same.
    BevK56 and Equinox_Boss like this.
  12. Exactly, the point would be that there is little or no change in prices, just allow for more flexibility and competition.

    Right now, Iron is at 2r per ingot. If I, starting a new shop, wanted to compete, I would have to effectively cut my income from Iron in half. That is not good and not the way things should be, very little room for competition.

    After the 10x rise, I could lower to 19r per, compete with other shops and still make a profit.
    Equinox_Boss likes this.
  13. Now you've said that, you have kind of pleased me a little.

    Because I would probably not change my prices unless I couldn't do anything to help it. SMP4 is my home server, and its the cheapest server I've seen.

    So this begs to differ, would this affect other servers (SMP1? for example) differently to SMP4
    Equinox_Boss likes this.
  14. Again, it would not be that instant. Raising income won't make everyone rich tomorrow.
    Equinox_Boss likes this.
  15. That's up to you the players, all I'm talking about doing is giving you more rupees. how you price things would still be in your control.
    Equinox_Boss likes this.
  16. But what about the massive iron farms. If its true about the 1.8 nerf being called off, then the price of iron and gold will stay down as people can flood the market with the cheaper prices.

    I know demand will increase, but people will still go for the cheapest shop, and there a lot of places with these massive farms. It depends if they increase their prices too, if they do its fine (kinda...) if they don't then this change is nothing more than changing the values of rupees.
  17. Just a quick second think, but if the rupees aren't modified, but players are given x10 more rupee's per day, then eventually shops price SHOULD increase... only if shop owners see that people have the money to spend. (I may have missed that before :p)

    Also: if it looks like I'm overposting its just I post then I see a new reply to my message, so I reply and so on and what not
    Equinox_Boss likes this.
  18. But there is no problem with that. It is supposed that things kinda stay the same, and people can afford the same stuff. It's just that when it's more money, you can differ more. So, like:
    before:
    player A has 10,000r
    player B sells for 2r per
    player C sells for 1r per
    Player A would most likely buy from player C, who would then sell 10,000 ingots for 10,000 r.

    After:
    Player A has 100,000r
    Player B sells for 20r per
    Player C sells for 19r per
    Player A would most likely buy from player C, who would then sell 5263 ingots for 10,000r
    So when players want to be competive with prizes, they won't lose as much profit
    Edit: RainbowChin was a bit faster with his reply, but anyways, I think we meant kinda the same:p
  19. my thoughts exactly alex! i work hard at having a large store, but where my lack of rupee flow comes from is 1. my lack of trust hiring staff, 2. i mine most of my items myself being as my rupee flow is too low to buy from suppliers, and 3. just to stay competitive in the market i feel i have to lower my prices to where its less then the worth of my time spent restocking supplies.

    with the current value of some of the more demanding items like stone, sand, etc. the value is so low that i can't seem to keep up with demand and at the same time make a buck :/ most of the rupees i make go right back into my shop.

    i also feel it should be done gradually so as not to create a shock effect to newer players just starting out and not so familiar with the price values of items.
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