[Controversial] American Politics

Discussion in 'Controversial Topics' started by Dr_Chocolate, Nov 21, 2016.

  1. So, uh.. they're closing the other thread for some reason since the election is over even though the vast majority of it was unrelated to the election. Anyhow, let's just use this thread to continue discussing our different point of views and political perspectives on the American political system. As always, please stay civil and anything not civil will be requested to be removed. Of course, anyone if welcome to contribute whether in the United States or not.

    I request this thread remain open unless it turns into a flame war, which in that case, I understand.

    So let's start with this. How do you guys feel about Trump's CIA pick openly admitting to being open to execute Edward Snowden.

    My view is that's absurd. Snowden is a national hero and should be praised. He should be pardoned immediately. He showed us how our government was not honoring our rights clearly listed in the fourth amendment. His intent was pure. Surely that won't be taken into account like it was into Hillary's case.

    EDIT: If you are sensitive to explicit language, clicking on links to 3rd party articles and videos attached on here may not be the best idea for you.

  2. I dont know much but.. They make mistakes.. Alot
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  3. lol. Most of his cabinet picks are very controversial...:confused:
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  4. I must admit, Snowden's exile is quite extreme and yes, he was doing a good thing. I can't imagine what the government would be doing right now had he not blow their cover. I hope he likes Russian food, 'cause I doubt America's ever going to pardon him... :\
  5. According to current rules, these threads are not allowed. Let me at least change the rule and get the new section up, then I'll move this in and unlock it =P
    Edit: food first
    Edit #2: Done
  6. Same as when I look back at the 60's / 70's where people's reputation and everything got ruined by Uncle Sam simply because there was a suspicion that the people in question might have had communist sympathies. Because, communism is bad, and very unpatriotic, so if you swung that way... Yeah, it was bad news. Normally you'd say innocent until proven guilty, but apparently this was all for the greater good.

    Or, more recent, what to think about the issue where an undercover CIA agent saw her cover getting blown simply because some "higher ups" apparently had a beef with her husband? I'm of course referring to the "Plame incident".

    Unfortunately there are a lot of screwballs around, and sometimes one can end up in a position of power with all the obvious results.

    However... There is of course a difference between venting a (maybe somewhat extreme) public opinion and actually acting on it.

    But I definitely agree with you regarding Snowden. Sure, technically speaking he has broken the law, no discussion there. But fact of the matter is still that if the others would have respected the law in the first place then there would have been little for Snowden to uncover. Yet that detail is something a lot of people tend to ignore, especially after listening to certain propaganda machines.

    As always with these things, just my 2 cents.
  7. Trump is a business man and money is what controls American politics. Of course a business man is going to go along with them. Imagine all the other things that could get leaked if they don't make an example out of Snowden.
  8. controversial opinion.... i'm right and you're wrong. nanny nanny boo boo.
  9. The fact that Trump wants to appoint a creationist to the head of the department of education makes me want to vomit
  10. Lets weight in on this for a second. It's just so astounding that such a profound and thought provoking statement can be so controversial.
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  11. I think public opinion regarding Snowden's acts is a lot like illegal immigration. It is based mainly on people's views of authority and falls roughly into two categories. Some people might see income disparity as a problem that needs to be resolved in order to stop the flow of immigration and feel that it will not stop until the underlying problem is resolved. Others are more pragmatic and say a rule's a rule and it doesn't matter why. We must round them up and send them home.

    Snowden committed an act of treason by revealing possibly damaging information about our nation. The information documented our government ignoring the 4th Amendment on a industrial scale. Similarly to imigration, whether one or the other, or both of these acts can be excused will depend on our individual personalities and views.

    Another factor in regard to Snowden's case is that he is an individual whereas his "opponent" is an institution. Similar to immigrants, it is a faceless "them" to many of us and influences our opinion. Although there were individuals in that institution who made decisions to deliberately break constitutional law, I cannot say who they were even though it has probably been in the news. It is not common knowledge. At this point if we have an opinion it is about Snowden versus "The Man". Some people will naturally side with authority and explain the rule breaking away because the CIA did what they did for our own good. Others are going to see Snowden as David taking on Goliath.

    I have seen many examples of our government doing what I thought was wrong but I also knew the government was legally obligated to do these things so I have to accept them and hope the law is changed as a solution. In the Snowden case, the government broke the law and it is questionable whether good came of it or not.

    We can't logically have it both ways. If in one situation our government must follow the law when the public generally sees the law as wrong and in another situation our government is allowed to disregard the law to do right for us, then the law has no meaning.

    How can we condone breaking the law, but not someone who reveals that the law was broken? Snitches get stitches aside, if we prosecute Snowden for treason, then we should not allow other responsible individuals to hide behind institutional walls and break our laws for good or bad. We should search out each individual involved with breaking constitutional law and prosecute them as well.
  12. We will not agree on this Dr. Chocolate. Snowden didn't only reveal to the American public how they were being spied on he also revealed to other countries including China and Russia how we had been spying on them. He gave them classified information important to our national security. He is a traitor through and through. It was one of the most damaging breaches in our nation's history. Maybe you feel that we should not be spying on countries like these while they spy on us with impunity but I would disagree. So, what is the punishment for a traitor? Just let him get away with it? Maybe there should no laws regarding this? There could be a new industry for people who can sell our countries secrets to China and Russia since they shouldn't get in trouble for doing it.
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  13. This might not be very relevant, but I can't post it on the thread where it is relevant: Krysyy didn't end up getting the last post nor did any of us, I'm surprised and slightly disappointed. :p
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  14. I heard that Clinton might ask for a recount; computer scientists did the math and said that they found evidence that the polls were rigged. (Check CNN for more details.)

    Honestly, I've kind of happy with puppet Trump, he's not going to do anything he said during his campaign.
  15. CNN has always been biased towards her
  16. you kidding me? 3/4ths of their airtime was Donald Trump rallies. the rest was them arguing about said rallies. that's free advertisement.
  17. But in the end, they almost always decided that Clinton was perfect
  18. You know what astounds me. All these republicans that were terrible terrible to Trump when he was running. They said awful things about him. They are now lining up to kiss his butt and get jobs from him in his administration. How do you so totally sell out your personal integrity and ethics to get a job? I could never do that and I am not someone that should have the high level of integrity that we hope our elected officials should have. It is so sad.
  19. Please do not be so rude in criticizing other people. You might as well say "if you think this way you are so idiotic(or insert other negative adjective here) it makes me want to puke"

    There are far better ways to express how you feel about it than targeting a large section of the country with no reason stated.
  20. It's a programmed response cowland. Those of us that understand how outlandish the big bang theory and evolution is understand the level of brainwashing that must take place to believe that stuff. Then they accuse anyone that tries to get them to understand of being crazy lol. Divide and conquer or whatever. I don't know what "creationists" think but I know what the mainstream science "experts" say and it can't be that ridiculous. ;-)

    I have actually seen articles lately in "science" magazines that carefully allude that this world is controlled by intent and a sort of "virtual reality" that we live in. I read that and was like... wait... are they going to tell the truth?

    Edit: found something similar: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/are-we-living-in-a-computer-simulation/#

    Edit 2: This can be accused of not being on topic but when top level officials are being put into a position of power in our politics and they have views like this then it's definitely on topic. :p